REFLECTOR: Help with poor running Franklin
Laurence Coen
lwcoen at hotmail.com
Thu Mar 26 12:55:04 CDT 2009
Jerry,
The correct carburetor is a MA 4-5 10-4865
--------------------------------------------------
From: "Laurence Coen" <lwcoen at hotmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 11:24 AM
To: "Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list" <reflector at tvbf.org>
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Help with poor running Franklin
> Jerry,
>
> I seem to remember someone having a similar problem with a Franklin. It
> turned out that the MA-5 comes in different models with different
> venturis. When he got the right carb the engine ran fine. My engine
> manual is at the hanger but I will check the number and get back to you.
>
> Larry Coen
> N136LC
> SE/RG Franklin/IVO
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "Jerry Teitsma" <jerryteits at comcast.net>
> Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 9:24 PM
> To: <reflector at tvbf.org>
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Help with poor running Franklin
>
>> Please help me with your ideas for my dilemma.
>>
>> I have flown my Velocity Elite FG for 26 hours but the engine has never
>> run well. I have attributed that to oil blow by that has frequently
>> fouled plugs. The rings did not seat at least partially due to the high
>> altitude where I fly (8200 ft. field and flying at 10,000 ft or more as
>> well as the hard steel cylinder linings. As a result, I recently pulled
>> the engine and did a top end overhaul with new softer cylinder liners.
>> It now runs even worse. I can't get more than 1500 rpm although it idles
>> fairly well. It cuts in and out with back firing intermittently. It
>> acts like it is starving for fuel or has induction leaks. It is fairly
>> non-reactive to mixture changes.
>>
>> Following is a list of items that have been done in chasing the problem:
>>
>> 1. I plugged the exhaust pipes and pressurized the intake manifolds to
>> about 15 psi using soap to look for any induction leaks. I found none.
>>
>> 2. The MA-5 carburetor was removed and sent in to a test shop where it
>> was checked for flow rate and a service bulletin 13 was performed. It
>> tested out OK.
>>
>> 3. The fuel flow rate was checked and found adequate in fuel flow and in
>> pressure.
>>
>> 4. The mag timing was checked and rechecked and is right on.
>>
>> 5. The mags were taken off the engine and checked for correct action and
>> timing.
>>
>> 6. The wiring was traced through for the mags to the cylinders to make
>> sure they were not cross wired.
>>
>> 7. The spark plugs (nearly new) were removed, cleaned and gaped.
>>
>> 8. We removed the valve covers and checked the open and closing sequence
>> of intake and exhaust valves. All seem to occur at the correct time and
>> in the correct overlap.
>>
>> The only thing we can think of that has not been checked is the cam for
>> proper lift and timing.
>>
>> Although it has never run well, it has run better prior to the overhaul.
>> Has anyone experienced similar problems? Any ideas? I would really
>> appreciate your input. JT
>>
>> Jerry Teitsma
>> PO Box 796, Granby CO 80446 (USPS mail/shipping)
>> 36 Lodgepole Ct, Granby CO 80446 (UPS/FedEx shipping)
>> 970-887-3910 (Phone/Fax)
>> jerryteits at comcast.net
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: <reflector-request at tvbf.org>
>> To: <reflector at tvbf.org>
>> Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 10:11 AM
>> Subject: Reflector Digest, Vol 58, Issue 52
>>
>>
>>> Send Reflector mailing list submissions to
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>>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
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>>> Today's Topics:
>>>
>>> 1. Re: I'm passing on this destination (gattenby at tulsaconnect.com)
>>> 2. Elevator cuff (gattenby at tulsaconnect.com)
>>> 3. Re: Elevator cuff (Brian Michalk)
>>> 4. Re: Elevator cuff (Stockman, Bill)
>>> 5. Re: Elevator cuff (nmflyer1 at aol.com)
>>> 6. Re: Elevator cuff (Dennis Martin)
>>>
>>>
>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 1
>>> Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 14:01:31 -0500
>>> From: <gattenby at tulsaconnect.com>
>>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: I'm passing on this destination
>>> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
>>> Message-ID: <web-22756828 at cgpro2.tulsaconnect.com>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>>
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>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 2
>>> Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 09:41:39 -0500
>>> From: <gattenby at tulsaconnect.com>
>>> Subject: REFLECTOR: Elevator cuff
>>> To: reflector at tvbf.org
>>> Message-ID: <web-22920556 at cgpro2.tulsaconnect.com>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>>
>>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
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>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 3
>>> Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 09:51:18 -0500
>>> From: Brian Michalk <michalk at awpi.com>
>>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Elevator cuff
>>> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
>>> Message-ID: <49CA44E6.6070800 at awpi.com>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>>>
>>> http://www.tvbf.org/search.html
>>>
>>> It used to be on the main page. I need to add it.
>>>
>>> gattenby at tulsaconnect.com wrote:
>>>> I've looked through the archives for a while. (any way to do a
>>>> search?) for info on the elevator cuffs.
>>>> I didn't find anything, I know it's been discussed...
>>>>
>>>> My 2000 suv kit came with the cuffs, the new manuals don't mention
>>>> them.
>>>> Some builder sites have pictures of putting them on, some don't.
>>>>
>>>> What's the general thought on putting them on?
>>>>
>>>> Noel
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> To change your email address, visit
>>>> http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector
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>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 4
>>> Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 10:54:33 -0400
>>> From: "Stockman, Bill" <bill.stockman at daytonaero.com>
>>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Elevator cuff
>>> To: "Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list" <reflector at tvbf.org>
>>> Message-ID:
>>> <1C2BDF8F50E7444BA5B4E343D9FD6AA101210A79 at MI8NYCMAIL01.Mi8.com>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>>
>>> They came with my kit (173 FGE LW) that I purchased in 1997, but was
>>> advised by the factory to remove them once I put the VGs on.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Bill Stockman, Senior Associate
>>>
>>> Dayton Aerospace
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> (937) 369-4799 cell
>>>
>>> (937) 426-4300 work
>>>
>>> bill.stockman at daytonaero.com
>>>
>>> ________________________________
>>>
>>> From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On
>>> Behalf Of gattenby at tulsaconnect.com
>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 10:42 AM
>>> To: reflector at tvbf.org
>>> Subject: REFLECTOR: Elevator cuff
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I've looked through the archives for a while. (any way to do a search?)
>>> for info on the elevator cuffs.
>>>
>>> I didn't find anything, I know it's been discussed...
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> My 2000 suv kit came with the cuffs, the new manuals don't mention
>>> them.
>>>
>>> Some builder sites have pictures of putting them on, some don't.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> What's the general thought on putting them on?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Noel
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -------------- next part --------------
>>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
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>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 5
>>> Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 11:40:47 -0400
>>> From: nmflyer1 at aol.com
>>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Elevator cuff
>>> To: reflector at tvbf.org
>>> Message-ID: <8CB7B7732F914B5-1448-F7F at webmail-mf12.sysops.aol.com>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>>
>>>
>>> I've asked about this as well. The consensus I have received back is
>>> that it is best to leave them off. I was told this will lower the stall
>>> speed of the canard. It will also make the "pitch buck" once it does
>>> stall more pronounced. I think I was told that it helps elevator
>>> authority when slow as well.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Kurt
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: gattenby at tulsaconnect.com
>>> To: reflector at tvbf.org
>>> Sent: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 8:41 am
>>> Subject: REFLECTOR: Elevator cuff
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I've looked through the archives for a while. (any way to do a search?)
>>> for info on the elevator cuffs.
>>>
>>> I didn't find anything,? I know it's been discussed...
>>>
>>> ?
>>>
>>> My 2000 suv kit came with the cuffs,? the new manuals don't mention
>>> them.
>>>
>>> Some builder sites have pictures of putting them on, some don't.
>>>
>>> ?
>>>
>>> What's the general thought on putting them on?
>>>
>>> ?
>>>
>>> Noel
>>>
>>> ?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> To change your email address, visit
>>> http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector
>>>
>>> Visit the gallery! www.tvbf.org/gallery
>>> user:pw = tvbf:jamaicangoose
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>>>
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>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 6
>>> Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 10:11:03 -0600
>>> From: Dennis Martin <dennis.doc at gmail.com>
>>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Elevator cuff
>>> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
>>> Message-ID:
>>> <638df660903250911r1a7ea549jb06aae6bee4eeae8 at mail.gmail.com>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>>>
>>> Evidence clearly supports removing the cuff. There is a compromise. Alan
>>> Shaw, who built my canard, told me to remove half of the cuff on each
>>> elevator. I did that a couple of years ago, so I'll try flying with 50%
>>> cuff
>>> and see how it works.
>>>
>>> Dennis
>>>
>>> On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 9:40 AM, <nmflyer1 at aol.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I've asked about this as well. The consensus I have received back is
>>>> that
>>>> it is best to leave them off. I was told this will lower the stall
>>>> speed of
>>>> the canard. It will also make the "pitch buck" once it does stall more
>>>> pronounced. I think I was told that it helps elevator authority when
>>>> slow as
>>>> well.
>>>>
>>>> Kurt
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: gattenby at tulsaconnect.com
>>>> To: reflector at tvbf.org
>>>> Sent: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 8:41 am
>>>> Subject: REFLECTOR: Elevator cuff
>>>>
>>>> I've looked through the archives for a while. (any way to do a
>>>> search?)
>>>> for info on the elevator cuffs.
>>>> I didn't find anything, I know it's been discussed...
>>>>
>>>> My 2000 suv kit came with the cuffs, the new manuals don't mention
>>>> them.
>>>> Some builder sites have pictures of putting them on, some don't.
>>>>
>>>> What's the general thought on putting them on?
>>>>
>>>> Noel
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> To change your email address, visit
>>>> http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector
>>>>
>>>> Visit the gallery! www.tvbf.org/gallery
>>>> user:pw = tvbf:jamaicangoose
>>>> Check new archives: www.tvbf.org/pipermail
>>>> Check old archives: http://www.tvbf.org/archives/velocity/maillist.html
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------
>>>> Need a job? Find employment help in your
>>>> area<http://yellowpages.aol.com/search?query=employment_agencies&ncid=emlweusyelp00000002>
>>>> .
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> To change your email address, visit
>>>> http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector
>>>>
>>>> Visit the gallery! www.tvbf.org/gallery
>>>> user:pw = tvbf:jamaicangoose
>>>> Check new archives: www.tvbf.org/pipermail
>>>> Check old archives: http://www.tvbf.org/archives/velocity/maillist.html
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> All the best,
>>> Dennis
>>> -------------- next part --------------
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>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Visit the gallery! tvbf:jamaicangoose
>>>
>>> End of Reflector Digest, Vol 58, Issue 52
>>> *****************************************
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> To change your email address, visit
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>>
> _______________________________________________
> To change your email address, visit
> http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector
>
> Visit the gallery! www.tvbf.org/gallery
> user:pw = tvbf:jamaicangoose
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> Check old archives: http://www.tvbf.org/archives/velocity/maillist.html
>
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